« "The most appalling spying machine that has ever been invented" | Main | An Uncertain World II: Adapt, by Tim Harford »

TrackBack

TrackBack URL for this entry:
http://www.typepad.com/services/trackback/6a00d83451d3b369e2015432ae7a46970c

Listed below are links to weblogs that reference An Uncertain World 1: Future Babble by Dan Gardner:

Comments

Feed You can follow this conversation by subscribing to the comment feed for this post.

Seth Finkelstein

> After the spectacular failure of financial experts everywhere to predict the 2008 crash ...

The media system does not select for accuracy. It selects for popularity. This does not mean accuracy is impossible. It means it isn't VALUED. More complicated, it also isn't very useful either (to some extent, it is, but far less than one might think).

Quite a few things are predictable, but it's much better to say afterwards "No one could have predicted ..." rather than "We all knew it was going to blow-up eventually, but we were on the gravy train and we got while the getting was good".

Regarding Milgram - I think you slipped in a question-begging and equivocation right here: "judging that the authority figure in the white coat would not tell them to do something harmful without good reason". That is, "good reason" covers a lot of ground - e.g. torture. And as far as they were led to believe, they subject was feeling intense pain.

tomslee

The media system does not select for accuracy. It selects for popularity. This does not mean accuracy is impossible. It means it isn't VALUED.

A good distinction, and one I overlooked. And predictions of crashes are only useful if they come with pretty good timing too, of course. So yes, I think you have something that the "who could have known?" response is in part a big shrug of the shoulders from someone with their hand caught in the cookie jar. More on this in the next post...

Re Milgram "as far as they were led to believe, the subject was feeling intense pain" - yes, this is the standard. But that's asserting that the participants believed the lie that the experimenter was telling them, and I don't see how that step is justified.

RAD

When it comes to product management, I suspect that you are placing too much weight on the value of "predictions" compared to the knowledge that you already possess. If you were tasked with laying out the plan for a new product at Proctor and Gamble I think you would spend the majority of your time acquiring the existing knowledge that P&G product planners have.

Seth Finkelstein

> But that's asserting that the participants believed the lie that the experimenter was telling them, and I don't see how that step is justified.

Have you ever seen the videos which were recorded? Their belief is very clear. It's quite informative.
There's a sort of presentism in projecting back decades to the participants thinking "This isn't a real experiment, those aren't real shocks, it's all a set-up to test if I'd really kill someone".

It's not too much of a reach to see the fake experiment replicated for real in interrogation with torture, and the memoirs of torturees (and even torturers) match pretty well with what's shown, in terms of the psychology.

tomslee

Fair enough. I have seen them, but it was a long time ago and I had forgotten. I concede (good job it was just a footnote).

Seth Finkelstein

Thanks. I think it almost makes Internet history when someone concedes a point due to blog comments :-).

FYI, on predicting the financial crash, see this blog post from good financial blog:

http://www.ritholtz.com/blog/2011/02/the-truth-about-the-financial-crisis-part-iii/

Myth 7: Nobody saw it coming.

Reality 7: No. Plenty of people saw it coming and said something.The problem wasn’t seeing, it was listening.

Josie

I'm a bit late to the party, but in defence of the suggested interpretation of Milgram, I think there are a range of possible belief states between "its a set-up" and "its fully, devastatingly real".

I'm assuming things like this were going through their heads on some level: "This can't be happenning. I don't have to deal with it because it just can't be real". That isn't exactly thinking that it was all a set-up, but is not exactly fully believing in it either. And that (possibly semi-conscious) intuition was right - it wasn't real.

The importance of this is just that such a state of shocked disbelief might fade quite rapidly, as the subject orientated themselves again.

Verify your Comment

Previewing your Comment

This is only a preview. Your comment has not yet been posted.

Working...
Your comment could not be posted. Error type:
Your comment has been posted. Post another comment

The letters and numbers you entered did not match the image. Please try again.

As a final step before posting your comment, enter the letters and numbers you see in the image below. This prevents automated programs from posting comments.

Having trouble reading this image? View an alternate.

Working...

Post a comment

Circular References

  • Could Try Harder
    This here is a relaxed, slow-moving weblog. It ain't one o' them hyperactive updated-all-the-time weblogs. Slow down a little.

Books

Blog powered by TypePad
Member since 11/2005

Tools

  • Sitemeter